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11:37 am
December 20, 2009
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Scott
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Hi everyone, my name's Scott and I'm a micro stakes fish. I desperately want to get better and move up in limits but am totally confused. I have tried many different strategies. but at best I am a break even to losing player. I know that SSNLHE isn't specifically geared to micro stakes, but I'm hoping someone here can help me.
Is there anyone reading this who started out at the 1 cent/2 cent tables on Full Tilt and has successfully moved up? If so, how did you do it? I read so much on discussion forums and in books that says you should play tight, ABC poker. No fancy plays, because players at these limits won't be on that level. I have also heard to use a small ball approach because people will pay you off when you hit straights, flushes, what have you. In my experience, this has not been the case (at least, not recently). If a flush card falls, forget about getting paid off. Even if I flop a set against the preflop raiser, it's hard to get paid. As soon as I play back at her, she shuts down. (Wanted to give credit to all the female players out there.)
I've also tried playing loose aggressive. This doesn't work for me as I eventually walk into someone who trapped me and I give back everything I had won. I've also tried various short stacking strategies. It seems people just don't go all in with you anymore. I pick up the blinds. The one time they do go all in, they have aces and I get smacked. Finally, I figured that if they play so tight, maybe I should try floating them. Again, that doesn't seem to be worth the risk I'm taking. I win a bit a few times, but then give it all back that one time they have the goods. I've heard that when players are really tight, you will make most of your money by bluffing. If this is the case, HOW do I avoid giving back all my gains in one hand?
Anyway, I'm thoroughy confused by all the conflicting advice and literature out there. Is there anyone that has been through what I have and has moved up and can provide some serious advice on how to move up?
Thanks for reading this micro stakes fish's post and thanks in advance for any help…
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2:37 am
December 21, 2009
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Lorenzo
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I'm a micro stakes fish too. I've run from 100 to 650$ but went back to 300$. My opinion is that poker has become much harder in the last 2 years. Nobody plays bad anymore and, to win, you have to play very aggressive and know perfectly your opponents. Autopilot poker is losing poker. And at the microstakes the rake is so high that winning is almost impossible. Go to higher stakes or spend better your time. My 2 cents.
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5:48 am
December 21, 2009
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Murthag
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Hi Scott,
This is funny because when a player starts to play poker, he feels that he can crush people. My first strategy was pretty simple : limp ALL hands PF then bet pot/shove on 2pairs or better.
Then the players start to realise that there is more than that and begin to learn basic strategy from forums and books. They start to play tighter and in position. they develop a preflop strategy and some lines postflop. At this level, they probably beat some of the lowest levels.
But then again, when moving up in the stakes, they realise that there's more than that and that's it's not enough. (Believe me, it's not bad luck!)
Actually you have to understand that the more complex your strategy is, the better you'll be. The more you'll learn, the more you work, the better you'll be.
For me, the first read of SSNLH helped me beat 10NL (5BB+ on 50k hands with a steady earning line). I think that if you play by the book, you should beat this level too, but that's only a start. You'll learn much more by practicing and reviewing your session, reading forums, watching videos, re-reading SSNLH (3rd time for me).
Don't worry, your game will slowly and steadily improve.
There is no such thing as "Do X and Y and u'll win any poker game". There's only hard work.
Btw, @ 25NL, I think that the majority of the players go All-in with as little as TPTK and sometimes less. But sometimes you don't get paid with your good hand, it happens. It's call variance. You can wait for a PF hand during 10 minutes 8-multitabling. You can wait to flop something for 30 minutes. Your cbets can be raised 5 times in a row. You can have 3 flushes beaten by better flushes in 10 minutes (true story). It happens!
So don't worry, continue to read/learn SSNLH, continue to review your session at the end and see what went wrong (or good) and adapt, continue to practice regulary and often, continue to post and read post, continue to think to your game and how you can improve. And more important, continue to enjoy and have fun !!
Murthag
PS : Btw Ed, Sunny, Matt, can you please please please release the new version before Thursday. I need to print the book before going on a trip for 10 days and I'm dying to know the new stuff in there! I don't think I can wait until I come back :p
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4:09 pm
December 28, 2009
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pythoneer
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At the micro-stakes, 25NL and under, well, yes, I think a nit style can be easier for you than playing the LAG style from this book. Playing tight is profitable there, the idea is people are calling too much. But you still have to do some thinking. At every situation ask yourself: Am I dominating? If you are, call, or raise when you think they won't fold. If you are not, fold, just avoid the variance. If they reraise ask yourself if they would do that with the dominated hand you were hoping they have. This will make you play a nitty style, but I think it is indeed easier and more profitable than the LAG style from the book, at the micro stakes. However, your goal should be to become good enough to beat the small stakes and higher, right?
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10:49 pm
December 28, 2009
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Scott
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That's just it. In my experience, at the micro stakes tables on Full Tilt, they are NOT calling too much. I don't think a nitty style is very profitable here. There are so many players, that's it darn near impossible to have a meaningful HUD stat sample on the players. Without HUD stats, I can never know which players I can bluff and which ones I can't. On the other hand, if I wait for big hands or set mine or wait for a flush, straight, or full house, I rarely get paid off.
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4:47 am
December 29, 2009
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pythoneer
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If I have less than 100 hands, I use VPIP and PFR. If there is a large gap between the two, the player is bad. If I have not at least 2 bad players at the table, I leave. And one of them I want to have a VPIP over 32 or so 
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6:35 am
December 29, 2009
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ellased
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i play 1-2 cent tables pretty much to put into practice what i've read. so invariably there are others like me that are doing the same.
just keep observing your opponents. do you use tracking software? that could help though i have been burnt on relying too deeply on hold'em manager.
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7:36 am
December 31, 2009
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Rocketfingers
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Dear Scott,
My poker story begun with a 50$ promotion bonus what I discovered after seeing the pros in the tv taking down some serious money. I was young and thought if they can do it than I can. I was clever enough to pick up a book before jumping into poker, and that book was Poker Theory by David Slansky.
Ofcourse at the first read I understanded like nothing from the book, but at least I picked up bankrool management, and thankfully for that I played the lovest limits on Party poker, and played some freerolls also. My "bankroll" begin to melt and I had only 20$ from the original 50$ when won some freerolls and was up to 70$. That time I played only full ring limit and NL freerolls. I started to move up and read some more books (Small stakes holdem by Ed Miller/ Slansky) and I discovered there are bonuses and rakebacks. So I moved to T6 that was a new site at that time, what I lost at cash games I all got it back at the freerolls and guaranteed tournaments.
I gathered some "serious" money (like 250€) and was lucky enough to move big chunk of this money to Full Tilt before T6 went down ( by the way they still own me 75€). At that time I moved to No Limit full ring and had some succes in it, so I tried anything to improve my game. I read 2+2 sometimes, and joined Stoxpoker. With the bonus and rakeback I moved up from 10NL to 50NL.
I stuck at 50NL for about a year because I played like 5 hours a week, and had to gether the knowledge to really crush 50NL. After reading SSNLH I worked a lot on my game and put in as many hours as I really could and I moved up to 100NL, that was my dream stake, from the very beginnig I said if I can become even a marginal winner at 100NL than all my efforts were worthwhile, and here I am.
This took me 3 very long years but in the first 2 I played very little poker. Now I try to improve my game to crush 100NL also and hopefuly I can become a pro next year. In this 3 years I deposited no more than 150$ to my accounts so from nearly nothing I built up a roll enough to hang around at the 100NL games.
This 3 years were really long, there were 2-3 months when I thought I learned nothing and I was really confused about my future in poker, but all that hard work turned out to be worthvile. So my first advice is don't think your efforts are in vain. Running bad sometimes can really confuse people but don't let it turn you down.Never let yourself to be confused or think that you can't do it, because you can!I recommend you joining one of the training sites, my favourite is Stoxpoker, they have a lot of very good coaches like Ed Miller. Read every poker book you can, read them 2 times 3 times 4 times until you know them by heart. Next recommendation is to be patient, poker is very hard to beat no matter what are the stakes. Bottom line is work hard and on a nice day your dreams become true.
Good Luck and Good Grinding!
Rocketfingers,
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2:19 pm
February 23, 2010
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Madtex
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Rocketfingers said:
Dear Scott,
My poker story begun with a 50$ promotion bonus what I discovered after seeing the pros in the tv taking down some serious money. I was young and thought if they can do it than I can. I was clever enough to pick up a book before jumping into poker, and that book was Poker Theory by David Slansky.
Ofcourse at the first read I understanded like nothing from the book, but at least I picked up bankrool management, and thankfully for that I played the lovest limits on Party poker, and played some freerolls also. My "bankroll" begin to melt and I had only 20$ from the original 50$ when won some freerolls and was up to 70$. That time I played only full ring limit and NL freerolls. I started to move up and read some more books (Small stakes holdem by Ed Miller/ Slansky) and I discovered there are bonuses and rakebacks. So I moved to T6 that was a new site at that time, what I lost at cash games I all got it back at the freerolls and guaranteed tournaments.
I gathered some "serious" money (like 250€) and was lucky enough to move big chunk of this money to Full Tilt before T6 went down ( by the way they still own me 75€). At that time I moved to No Limit full ring and had some succes in it, so I tried anything to improve my game. I read 2+2 sometimes, and joined Stoxpoker. With the bonus and rakeback I moved up from 10NL to 50NL.
I stuck at 50NL for about a year because I played like 5 hours a week, and had to gether the knowledge to really crush 50NL. After reading SSNLH I worked a lot on my game and put in as many hours as I really could and I moved up to 100NL, that was my dream stake, from the very beginnig I said if I can become even a marginal winner at 100NL than all my efforts were worthwhile, and here I am.
This took me 3 very long years but in the first 2 I played very little poker. Now I try to improve my game to crush 100NL also and hopefuly I can become a pro next year. In this 3 years I deposited no more than 150$ to my accounts so from nearly nothing I built up a roll enough to hang around at the 100NL games.
This 3 years were really long, there were 2-3 months when I thought I learned nothing and I was really confused about my future in poker, but all that hard work turned out to be worthvile. So my first advice is don't think your efforts are in vain. Running bad sometimes can really confuse people but don't let it turn you down.Never let yourself to be confused or think that you can't do it, because you can!I recommend you joining one of the training sites, my favourite is Stoxpoker, they have a lot of very good coaches like Ed Miller. Read every poker book you can, read them 2 times 3 times 4 times until you know them by heart. Next recommendation is to be patient, poker is very hard to beat no matter what are the stakes. Bottom line is work hard and on a nice day your dreams become true.
Good Luck and Good Grinding!
Rocketfingers,
Great feed back there Rocket!!!
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8:13 am
February 24, 2010
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Rocketfingers
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Thank you.. Thank you… 
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