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11:33 am
October 15, 2009


Scott

Guest

What should I do if I open steal from the button or small blind, get called, and connect with the flop none whatsoever?

10:46 am
October 16, 2009


mullethaiku

Member

posts 96

My 2 cents:

From the small blind– generally I would still make a continuation bet most of the time, even if you don't connect witht the flop. Many of your less astute opponents will still see your preflop raise (steal attempt) as a sign of strength, so following up with a flop c-bet will take down alot of pots for you.  

But as always it would depend on your opponent. Against calling stations or loose players, try not stealling as much preflop, they will often just call or reraise you. Just wait for a good hand that connects and suck the calling station dry with value bets on every street (he'll keep calling) Against the loose aggressives, check calls/raises are great when you hit a big hand (let them hang themselves)

Against tight players, steal like crazy until they catch on (start 3 betting often preflop, etc.)  c-bet the flop most of time, even when you don't connect, they usually fold if they did not connect. Eventhough you will be out of position postflop in the SB, it can also be an advantage in blind/button battles because you can bet out first and usually take down alot of small pots.

From the button– if your opponent checks to you, c-bet often, you will win many small pots right there. If they check first, but they're calling stations or will check raise often. You may want to check behind, this will keep the pot small, and you may possibly hit on the turn or river, or you can fire a turn or river bluff bet if a scare card comes, and you will have position the whole way.

If a tight nit bets out of position on the flop, you may want to fold, this usually means they are stong,  but throw in some reraises in good spots, to keep them honest. (many "tight nits" will still c-bet like crazy) If the blinds are loose maniacs or calling stations, don't steal as much, it will not workas well. Tighten up, wait for a good hand and punish them when you get a big hand, they will pay you off (look for a few big pots as opposed to many small steal pots)

10:12 am
November 6, 2009


threads13

Indianapolis

Member

posts 9

Good stuff by mullet….

I would like to add also that it depends on how open up you are as well.  If you are opening 100% then you should be a little less likely to c-bet all other things being equal simply because your range is so weak.  To this point, it's easier to get away with betting that weak range if you are otb than if you are in the sb.  

However, sometimes it just doesn't matter.  

4:54 pm
December 28, 2009


pythoneer

netherlands

Member

posts 10

Umm, are you saying that if you steal 100% you should c-bet less?  IIRC the more you steal the more you should c-bet, not?  If they start playing back, make notes, top their range, profit, amiright?

2:50 pm
December 31, 2009


threads13

Indianapolis

Member

posts 9

I'm saying that from a game theory standpoint you should tend to c-bet less with air and more when you have some sort of backup plan.  So, hence when you have a 100% pre-flop range. ..the more air you have in the range the less likely you should be to c-bet as a whole as a derivative to the betting with air.  There's plenty of factors involved here… if a guy is folding 80% to c-bets… then c-bet every time… sure.  Still, knowing where the lines are at is a good thing.  If he's playing reasonable well then you will have to give up on some c-bets.

8:55 am
January 4, 2010


mullethaiku

Member

posts 96

If you have PokerTracker or Hold'em Manager (which you should if you play online) then use your opponent's "Fold to c-bet %" on you HUD, as a guide as to whether you c-bet or not after a steal attempt gets called.

It's ok to steal 80%-100% of the time from the cutoff/button/small blind if your opponents have a "fold to steal %" over 80% or so. (Although I would not literally attempt to steal 100% of the time because it will be too obvious, you can fold your trash hands every now and then)

Now given you will be stealing a good bit vs. these tight opponents to your left, whether to c-bet the flop with air depends on their tendencies. If the knit calls your steal, but will play "fit or fold" on the flop, and has a high "fold to c-bet%" you can still c-bet liberally most of the time. However, if they call your steal, but play the flop strong once they enter the pot (low "fold to c-bet %") you may want to dial back the c-bets when you miss the flop.

The problem of when to c-bet after a steal attempt is largely decided by your opponents's tendencies, as opposed to a general theory.

Having said all that, in general you should still c-bet more than you check, especially after you raised preflop. As they say in SSNLHE…"just do it" Laugh  Even if you don't win the hand, at least you are making your opponent define his hand very early, which may save you money as opposed to guessing on later streets.

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