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TPTK as the aggressor. Did I overthink myself ?

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11:22 am
July 20, 2009


Jamleeco

Member

posts 12

1-3 live game. Villain has 130bb. I have him covered.

Villain is named Kenny. Kenny is a regular , plays higher sometimes as do I. Kenny is a solid player and can get quite tricky against the right opponent. We have played together before. Kenny is a better player than me. I do not fear him, but I rather not have him at my table. Also, even when I was live all the time, Kenny plays more hours than I do. I got back on line first of April and have not been to casino 4x in last 3 months. ( So little rusty with live reads/rhythm).

 

I haven’t played a hand for a couple of rounds, last hand I won a big pot with KK. One limper to me 4 off the button, I raise to $16 with AcQc (going to speak in dollars instead of bb’s this one time, that odd big blind makes accuracy tedious.) Kenny calls in sb, limper folds.

(Pot: 38) Flop comes QdTc5d .

Checked to me , I bet 35. Kenny check-raises me to 75. I immediately suspect him of slow playing AA or KK but know he could do this with JJ or KJ as well, sets are possible but unlikely I think. If I call raise, and I did, I know that Kenny knows that I have at least a queen. I know he could even check-raise me with air because he knows I ‘m c-betting this flop with a lot of holdings, including air myself. So I call because I don’t want to get pot-committed but feel folding would be ridiculous at this point.

Kenny will check the turn here, I have seen him make a move and follow with a check before. So when I call I do so with the plan of seeing what happens and if he makes a big bet turn bet, I’m folding, bluff or not.

( Was just calling here a bad play? Especially since I’m thinking of dumping the turn if pressured? )

 

(Pot: 188) turn comes 3c.

Kenny bets $100. He has $200 left behind. Now I know if I call and hit the flush, he is never going to put me on a backdoor flush draw. I have played with him enough to know if a club comes he is still value-betting the river and I will get the whole stack with a what’s-left raise. So I’m getting 4.8 to 1. I figure either queen is most likely an out, if he has a set , so be it. I figure the 3 A’s as one out at best. I feel confident in my call here,but comments are welcome.

(Pot: 388) river comes a blank

Kenny bets $100. Crap ! Of course I knew this was given almost no matter what came, maybe not if a queen. So here I am, getting 4.88 to 1. I feel like I’m more certain than even those high pot odds that I’m beat. I know you have to make laydowns, but almost 5-1, am I even good enough to be that sure. Like most players, myself included, these nice sized river bets are usually just what they seem. But then I also figure, Kenny knows that I know that he knows I have a queen . And he’s leaving 100 behind as he bets 100. I know that he knows that I know that it looks like he wants to get called. Unlikely that this bet is not real, but, 4.9 : 1. I call.

( Was this a bad call talking myself into pot’s too big to fold? And did I outhink myself here with all the I know he knows I know….)

And finally my main question. Should I have checked the flop? I thought about it and in retrospect, of course, I should have. But there were a couple of draws out there and I hate giving free cards. But on the other hand, I know Kenny will pounce on weakness. So checking keeps pot smaller but if he Pounces hard on the turn, now I ‘m lost when we go into river. In fairness to myself, I was going to fold to serious action on turn if I hadn’t picked up draw. But, was my mistake an early one that compounded itself? I feel checking flop would have been ok but felt like bet was ok too. But should I have bet smaller on flop? Same weakness theory applies , though. I don’t want to be chumming the water with TPTK against a good player. What should my main thoughts be here ? How much better would have a check or smaller bet been here?

Whew, sorry so long. All comments, criticisms, and ridicule welcome.

Thanks, JC

4:18 pm
July 20, 2009


JJS

Member

posts 48

Jamleeco said:

(Pot: 38) Flop comes QdTc5d .

Checked to me , I bet 35. Kenny check-raises me to 75. I immediately suspect him of slow playing AA or KK but know he could do this with JJ or KJ as well, sets are possible but unlikely I think.

I know he could even check-raise me with air because he knows I ‘m c-betting this flop with a lot of holdings, including air myself.


Sounds like you were fairly convinced that you had the best of it on the flop.  So, why are you afraid of committing here?  Why not reraise with the plan of getting it all in either now or on the turn?

8:37 am
July 21, 2009


jdk050507

Guest

Smells like a busted flush draw or AQ himself, but i think you have to call even if you think your beat, which you do.   I think I'm pushing all in on the turn. 

That's just me though.  If this were a weak regular in a live game you could probably fold the flop raise, as they usually don't raise unless they have a great hand…..depending on the player of course. 

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